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0-13...a new low

After watching today's disgusting performance, most Dolphin fans are left to wonder when this team will hit rock bottom.  I say that because just when you think they've hit rock bottom, things get even worse.  And now it's been 365 days since this team's last regular season win.  That's right, a full year.  Where does this team go from here?  I'm not sure.  There are so many problems that it's almost impossible to imagine this team ever turning things around.  So let's talk about some of the headlines from today's game, shall we?

Cam's Future
The day started out with FOX Sports' Jay Glazer reporting that there may be a mutiny brewing in Miami.  He reports that there may actually be players cursing Cam Cameron, both in meetings and on the field.  If this is accurate, and generally Glazer is pretty accurate, then things need to drastically change.  This is a problem that not only effects the players currently on the roster and their performance on the field but also hinders the Dolphins in free agency if Cam was to remain in Miami for another year.  A lot of time, players influence other players to come.  If the current players feel Cam is that much of a joke and feel that he's incompetent, then we are going to have a hard time trying to lure new players down here.  Sure, money and Miami's weather helps in recruiting.  But if the current players don't believe in their coach, why would any good free agent want to join this mess?

Then you have this game.  There's no way this Dolphins team should get blown out the way they did in Buffalo yesterday.  At most, the talent level on the Bills' roster is only slightly higher than the talent level on Miami's.  There's no way this Bills team is 21 points better than the Dolphins.  And that's when you have to look at coaching.  These Dolphin players didn't really look into it.  I don't think their effort was there.  And once they got behind 21-0, I definitely think some of the players packed it in for the day.  And that's an indictment of the head coach.  Then you have to question the inconsistent decision making by Cam.  He's aggressive and tries the surprise onsides kick in the middle of the 3rd quarter.  I liked that call and it almost worked. But then, on a 4th and 4 at Buffalo's 45 yard line later on in the 3rd, Cam decides to punt.  Are you kidding me?  Don't get me wrong, I don't think it would have changed the outcome of the game.  But those kinds if inconsistencies time and time again really have to make you question what the hell Cam is thinking.

Now, I've been a solid Cam supporter all season long.  But I'm sorry, I just can't do it any more.  A change really needs to be made.  When you have a rookie head coach, you generally like to give him time.  But we haven't seen any improvement in his play calling or decision making.  And now you got a potentially ugly situation developing in the locker room between the players and Cam.  Enough is enough.  I'm now beginning to think that even a change just for the sake of changing isn't even a bad idea.  Or maybe I'm just so depressed over how this season is going, that my judge is cloudy.  I just don't know anymore.

And as if all this wasn't enough, there's more.  ProFootballTalk is reporting that "there's talk in league circles that [Michigan] Athletic Director Bill Martin wants to pursue" Cam if he is fired by the Dolphins.  One source tolls PFT that Martin believes Cam's 0-13 record is an "aberration."  However, because of his performance this year, boosters and alumni might be against hiring Cam, who is a Michigan guy.  He spent 10 years as an assistant at Michigan.  PFT also believes that the fact that Cam could "land on his feet" may make it easier for Wayne Huizenga to fire him.  That, and the fact that Cam's buyout would be reduced because of his potential salary at Michigan.  This is certainly something we need to keep an eye on.  We all remember last year, around this time, when PFT was reporting that Nick Saban was interested in the Alabama job.  Many called the site "garbage" at the time...until Nick left for Alabama.  One thing is for sure, in my opinion, and that is the fact that when Mike Florio of PFT writes something that isn't really being reported much yet by the mainstream media, he's usually right on the money.  So like I've said, this situation certainly bears some wathcing.

The QB Saga Continues
The revolving door at QB that we've had to sit through since Dan Marino retired is becoming just ridiculous.  Today, after just 8 plays and a lost fumble that was returned by Buffalo for a touchdown, John Beck was benched in favor of Cleo Lemon.  And wouldn't you know that his very first play is a 50+ yard pass to Teddy Ginn, which is followed by a Samkon Gado 12 yard touchdown run.  First, let's talk Beck.  The one thing that really jumps out is how he had absolutely no time to throw on 2 of his six dropbacks.  And they were 3 step drops, no less.  You can't blame Beck for that.  The fumble was a freak thing, and something that plagued Cleo Lemon as well once he was put into the game.  It's funnt how the weather didn't seem to hinder Trent Edwards at all, though.  Go figure.  

Onto Cleo Lemon.  Did he play better than Beck has been playing?  Sure.  And for that, I guess I'm forced to eat my words a little bit.  But please don't try and tell me Cleo Lemon is a good quarterback.  His two interceptions were terrible decisions/passes.  The first one, when he overthrew an open David Martin, was just a horrific pass in which he threw off of his back foot.  He fumbled 4 times.  And he only had a 5.7 yards per attempt average against this poor Bills secondary.  For comaprisonm Beck had a 5.7 yards per attempt average against the #1 defense in the NFL (Steelers) in much worse playing conditions than in Buffalo yesterday.  So I don't want to hear anyone try to tell me that Cleo is this team's future QB.  He isn't.  But here's what I did notice.  I noticed the play calling become a bit more aggressive with Cleo in the game.  I saw this conservative offense open up a bit.  I noticed more shots taken vertically.  I saw more rollouts called for Cleo.  And it makes you wonder why these plays weren't called for John.  Why couldn't John take some shots deep?  

I also noticed the players actually playing better for Cleo.  Could it be just a coincidence?  Maybe.  But the offensive line was blocking much better for Cleo.  He had much more time to throw than John has had the past few weeks.  I saw Derek Hagan actually making plays for Cleo.  When Beck was in there, Hagan dropped like every other pass thrown his way.  And Cleo actually had some help on the ground, as Samkon Gado, who had 2 carries for 3 yards when John was in there, actually averaged 4.9 yards per carry the rest of the game when Cleo was in at QB.  And that includes those 2 terrific redzone runs for scores by Gado.  Of course, you have to consider the fact that Buffalo had a 21-0 lead by the time Cleo entered, meaning he might have been facing softer coverages that allowed for the higher completion percentage.  

Either way, you have to wonder what this might mean for John Beck's future.  Where do we go from here?  Is Cleo back to being the starter?  How much is John's confidence effected by this benching?  Is John Beck the QB that is going to lead us in the future?  Should the Dolphins think about targeting one of the top 3 college QBs in April's draft?  All these questions now need to be answered.  I think all we learned one thing from yesterday's embarrassment: the QB situation is as cloudy as ever.  And now all options are back in play.

Defensive Struggles Continue
Say what you want about the offense sucking (and it sure did), the defense wasn't any better.  With the time of possession about even, Buffalo's 31st ranked offense gained 389 yards of total offense and averaged 6.2 yards per play.  This secondary made Trent Edwards look like a star, throwing for 4 touchdowns on just 23 attempts.  And this front 7 allowed 2 100 yard rushers to the NFL's 20th ranked rushing offense.  That's simply pathetic and everyone on that field should be embarrassed by their performance.  

When Buffalo ran it, it seemed that one of two things happened.  The Bills' back, Marshwn Lynch or Fred Jackson, either broke a few tackles or simply wasn't touched until they got into the secondary.  And I don't want to hear any excuses about Zach and Channing being out.  There's simply no reason Fred f*cking Jackson should ever run for 115 yards on just 15 carries.  Giving up yards to Lynch is understandable.  But letting a guy like Jackson pick up chunks of yards at a time is a disgrace.

Then you got the nonexistant pass rush.  It seemed like Edwards could have been playing in a wheelchair and he still wouldn't have been touched in the pocket.  When this defense doesn't blitz, they get no pressure at all on the QB.  And even when they did blitz, they still couldn't get to the QB quick enough.  And that is highlighted by Lee Evans' 70 yard touchdown reception on a 3rd and 10 play that basically ended the game.  Travis Daniels, who can't cover any speedy receiver, was hung out to dry by the inability of Miami to not be able to get to Edwards despite bringing the blitz.  And the end result was the final nail in the coffin.

This & That
-Jason Allen continued to be active in run support.  But is that because he's getting better and better or because nobody in front of him could get a hand on the ball carrier?

-Derek Hagan had his best game as a professional, catching 8 passes for 93 yards.  But a majority of those catches came when Buffalo was playing very soft coverage late in the game.

-A positive for the Dolphins:  Rex Hadnot had a beautiful block, pulling from his right guard spot to spring Gado for his 20 yard touchdown run.  I'll tell you right now: Hadnot needs to be resigned in the offseason as quickly as possible.  He's a solid RG and is the vocal leader of this offensive line.

That's all for now.  Your thoughts below...

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welcome on board
matt

The bandwagon is growing rapidly but we still have plenty of room for people to join the 'fins need a new coach' chorus. However the reality is we just need one WH to join, otherwise I fear it could be another long year next year....

As to the rumor, wow could that really be true? would michigan do us all a favor and take Cam off our hands? since I really don't like michigan it would be a double blessing. sort of like wanny going to pitt.(gain by subtraction here, loss by addition there)

I strongly agree with your analysis of the game. spot on and a good job. One note I would like to add though, the Lemon's first pass was the first time they threw on first down. All three Beck possesions started with running plays for little or no yards, as buffalo packed the zone. Then when cleo finished doing his damage and the bills bumped up the lead at half, the bills dropped into a deep zone and let cleo throw the only pass he knows... dinks...

What really bothered me here was that Cam never thought of putting Beck back into the game, once the game was over. Why not let Beck build some confidence against a soft defensive coverage. So much for putting a QB into a situation where he can succeed.

My guess is Cam will go with Cleo the rest of the year and sub beck when the game gets out of hand.

So that means another year of caretaker QB's....
The biggest reason Cam should be fired, there was never a plan to get Beck ready to start.

shall we start start a pool to see who can quess Miami's starting QB next year? God, I hope it's not Losman.

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 10, 2007 2:19 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

oh I forgot
I also wanted to add, why has capers pretty much gotten a free ride this year. The defense has been a disaster all season, either unable to stop the run, or folding down the stretch in close games. Was there such a change between Buffalo I & buffalo II in personel to justify why they could shut down the bills running game in miami and could only say ole!! as they ran by them this time?

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 10, 2007 2:23 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i cant believe it but i am sold
Cam needs to get his out of miami fuck this i am so tired of it .... but now... who can take his place?!?!?!?

by KingOnSlaught on Dec 10, 2007 2:51 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Play calling!
I also didn't like putting Beck in that situation so early!  I feel we should have tried to esctablish the run.  The run has been the only confidence builder for this team all year.  On the interception/fumble (whatever the hell it was) run the ball a couple of times and so what if we have to crooked punt away.  

We needed to establish the run!

SIGN Hadnot now!

If everyone wants Cam out---(and I do)---shouldn't it be done now!

And any early choices?

by JGray on Dec 10, 2007 8:11 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I actually can't stand to look at him anymore
Cam and the Dolphins haven't shown an ounce of improvement over the course of the year for whatever reason.  I am actually beginning to hate Cameron.  Here's an example of what I classify as stupidity:
3rd and 10 from about the Bills 40, we dial up a play that sends Ginn? into the left side of the endzone and the pass falls incomplete.  We decide to go for it on fourth down and turn it over on downs.  Now here is my issue:  Why don't we have two plays in place that will allow us to gain a 1st down?  If we are planning on going for it on 4th down anyway, why try and pick up 40 yards on 1 play?  What about an 8-10 yard route, I'll even take a 5.6 Yd play and setup a 4th and short.  
It's this lack of planning and preparation, pregame and ingame that is destroying this team, as well as execution.
Coaching has now become one of the major major aspects of a game that all analysts and players talk about.  Offense, Defense, Special Teams, and COACHING.  The sad thing is that there's nobody to turn to, to coach this team for the rest of the season.  Cam has to go asap.

by MarkDuper85 on Dec 10, 2007 9:26 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I know what you mean
This whole staff needs to go, Cam,Capers and the ST coach. Were getting outplayed in all phases of the game. Wayne will wait till the seasons over to fire him(I hope) but at least if we get a new coach and coordinators we will be able to lure some free agents. The way I figure is if Cam was any good whatsoever we would have at least one win and if the players know that he needs to go then he needs to go. I think we need to keep Mueller, he would be compatible with Schottenheimer but not Cowher, so if we get Cowher we need a new GM also.Either of those moves should improve us tenfold.

by Finz4eva on Dec 10, 2007 10:08 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cut the Cowher crap
Do you really think that he wnats to give up  a suchy jon where he's making alot more money as an analyst then he did as a coach? And for this joke of a team?

Count me on the Fire Cam Bandwagon as well, my patience has run incredibly thin, and its not just the playcalling, the piss poor game management or handing the reigns to Mularkey.
Its the fact that he's really set back Beck's development yesterday.
What now Mr QB guru?

by Patssuck456 on Dec 10, 2007 10:16 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

not true
I believe cowher makes around 750k working on TV.
Should he return to coaching it is rumored that he wants around 7 mil a year. So the money isn't even close, however he does have a heck of a lot more free time on tv.

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 10, 2007 8:56 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

*Yawn*
Please,

Comp Att Yds Pct   TD   Int  Fumb
 22  42  241 52.4   0    2     3

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 10:14 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I have been saying it for a while...
Cam needs to go.  It's nothing but head scratching moves from day 1.  At first I was glad that he didn't listen to other people, and thought "Hey, this guy has a plan."  But now, as the season comes to a close, it is more evident that this guy has no plan....  =^(

The biggest bright spot of the season is Jay Feely.  Thats pathetic...

by TheSeaMammals on Dec 10, 2007 10:24 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why wait?
~"there's talk in league circles that [Michigan] Athletic Director Bill Martin wants to pursue" Cam if he is fired by the Dolphins.~

Hell, Alabama didn't. Come get him, please Bill.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 10:28 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cam Must Go
The head coach is responsible for the leadership, whether winning or losing.  He has led us to 0-13, time to pack the bags.  I give him credit for two things.  That is Beck and Ginn.  
I was at the Eagle/Dolphin game and was on the tunnel where the fins came out.  Before they took the field, Cam was standing alone just below me with a look of bewilderment on his face. He had no interaction with any of the players, just looked like a lost puppy.
Our future is in Beck/Ginn.  They had the chemistry at the Eagles but for some reason has not been used much since.  Lets rebuild our O line, get the receivers to stop dropping passes and get on with it.  Our D needs work, but the opponents starting field position hasn't helped either.  Bring on Cowher, a fresh crew and build on Beck!  

by Thruthickandt on Dec 10, 2007 10:33 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Low
Morning everyone.  Let me paint the picture for you:  I'm sitting at the game, exciting and shit talking all my Buffalo loving fans about how the Dolphins first win is just a few minutes away.  Bundled up and being pelted by hail, I watch this team fumble and drop their way to a quick 21-0 deficit.  My phone starts ringing with messages galore.  I refuse to take it out of my pocket, instead staring blankly at the field for the next 2 hours.  Sure there were some nice plays, but too many "could haves".  Even the big highlight, a 54 yard completion to Tedd Ginn should have been a touchdown.  Ginn on a post had nobody withing 15 yards of him, but the ball floats, floats, then finally comes down with Ginn barely moving.  He is even faster in person.  His muffed punt was his first, so I'll give him a pass on that one (maybe b/c he's the only exciting player on this team).  He's open A LOT.  I will say that.  Based on conversation from this website I really wanted to see if the WR get open or not.  They do.  
This team blows so bad it hurts.  Nobody can hold the ball, they fight it all the way.  Even when they are put in a position to make a play, they blow it.  Lance Schulters drops a sure TD INT.  Will Allen misses a slow hopper onside kick.  Nobody can cover Robert "Fucking" Royal?  C'mon.
This game was worse than the Jets game.  They can't play and they play even worse in cold weather.  We should be in the AFC south.

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 10:34 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We should be in the AFC south
Don't ya like that we are the only southern team in this division? All the other teams are far north hugged around NY, no advantage there.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 10:38 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

AFC south
That may have been the worst decision this franchise ever made b/c it works against us forever.  At least Wanny's impact is only killing us for a decade.

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 10:46 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I did
I gave you my reason and I said at the begining that you wouldn't like it. Just because you don't like it is no reason it's not a reason. Now, having said that you still haven't answered mine. Just who will be our next HC that you know will take this team to a SB within the next 3 years? In fact who would even want to step into the mess we call the Miami Dolphins at this point in time? With the talent level we have I have to wonder at this point just why Cameron would want to stay other than the fact that he signed a comtract and is an honorable man. So come on and give me your best shot, just who is your guy?

by gafinfan on Dec 10, 2007 11:37 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Georgia
I think you're comment is a good one, and I agree with you.  Believe me, I agree with you.  The issue that's been coming up lately is the question of confidence in the coach.  True or not, the media projects their reports onto teams, and this is how it is seen by everyone, including players on other teams.  With that type of image, we could be screwed in FA signings (players take less to be on good teams all the time) and we'll clearly never be on top of Eli Manning's list.  This is the ONLY reason I am beginning to think a change is needed.  I still believe he was/is a victim of circumstance, inheriting a bear trap from which to coach from that no other coach could have done anything with.  I think he can still be an effective coach, so if he stays on board, I'll continue to support him, but I just think it'll be harder to turn things around now.

Alternate coaches?  great question.  I just hope he's ready for a challenge

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 12:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ok
~Just who will be our next HC that you know will take this team to a SB within the next 3 years?~

Dunno

~With the talent level we have I have to wonder at this point just why Cameron would want to stay ~

Now I know your kidding, your just arguing to be arguing.

~So come on and give me your best shot, just who is your guy?~

Well, my guy

  1. Has a game plan.
  2. Knows how to handle rookies.
  3. Knows how to make adjustments.
  4. Decisive
  5. Knows how to play-call (without a committee).
  6. Knows when to call a timeout.
  7. Knows how to handle Public Relations.
  8. Doesn't look like a deer in headlights.
  9. Knows how to manage the game clock.
Any man that has all of the above, thats my guy.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 12:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Please notice
The above things I am looking for in a coach that I don't find with Cameron has NOTHING to do with the talent or the record of this team. It all points to Cameron's inability to do the job.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 12:15 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're wrong
I say that with respect because I'm not here just to argue with you or anyone else. Why would any man want to subject himself to some of the things that I've read that have been said about Cam. That is even more true when they show up at his daily news meeting and act so respectful. I'd want to act more like D. Green and blow up at them, wouldn't you?

I ask for a name but I guess I won't get one. I've named 3; just what do you think of any of them? Or would you rather wait and see how many games they lose before you comment?

by gafinfan on Dec 10, 2007 4:05 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You want a name?
Bill Cowher, there's your name. He didn't leave Pittsburgh because he was burntout, he left because the Rooney's wouldn't pay him. Give him the money he wants and 8/10 he's gonna come.

Cowher is everything Cameron isn't and most of all a WINNER.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 11:23 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

don't forget #10
I want a coach that is a winner. I'm sick and tired of coaches that have a history of losing in the nfl that talk big and act like they've led teams to the superbowl. no more wanny's, saban's, and Cam's. Shula way a tyrant, at least equal, to saban but no one questioned him because he had the authority of a winner. JJ was a control nut, but had the authority of a winner. What does Cam have... ah boys bobby taught me how to win, anyone want to go hunting with me....

I don't care who the dolphins get just get me someone who has a winning record after their name.

And now being somewhat contradictory, I'd love to see the fins go after OSU's Jim Tressel. I've been very impressed with his ability to jump from a small school winner to go right to the big time without a hiccup. I have no idea if they could land him, but NFL $$$ always motivates.

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 10, 2007 9:19 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Please don't try to go there
"Your boy" had 4 fumbles and 2 ints in just 3 quarters of play, while completing just over 1/2 his passes. Which has been typical of his play all

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 10:35 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lemon is not the answer.
Don't throw ethnic reasons into this.  Holds little water with me.  
Beck had one bad game (against the Jets) and you are ready to promote Lemon?  How many games did Lemon win for the Dolphins this year?  Did Lemon not give up the ball as many times against Buffalo as Beck did against the Jets?  Where is the heat on Lemon?  One successful pass play and he is the next messiah?  Play calling can help make anybody look good. Lets get Beck back in and get aggressive.

by Thruthickandt on Dec 10, 2007 10:41 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're not using much logic...
Mr. Logic

Are you Cleo Lemons mother?

Matt

by Matt27 on Dec 10, 2007 5:03 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How many games has Cleo won?
You're a complete idiot if you think this is racial.  

I don't have preconceived notions about Cleo.  I saw him play and he isn't good.  Bottom line.  I don't care if he's black, white, blue, green, or pink.  He stinks.

by Matty I on Dec 10, 2007 5:32 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Beck sucks
Beck stinks MORE than the stinky Cleo.  MIA MUST draft Matt Ryan or we won't have any players wanting to play here.  Remember why Stalworth chose NE...because he stated that it had a better QB situation.  So we need to let FA's "know" or at least "think" we are going Matt Ryan.  Because this Beck guy needs to stay the heck on the bench.  He sucks!  Rookie stuff is excuses.  More than just Dan Marino have done at least "exceptional" for their rookie years.  Rothlesberger isn't even that good and he did fine his rookie year.  Beck sucks, absolutely sucks!

by mred on Dec 10, 2007 6:55 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You assume one is racial because they are
prejudice or bias?  Being racial may be the basis of one's prejudice or bias.  Race has nothing to do with my opinion of Cleo's ability.  

Now, back to the issue.  We must both agree that Cleo's perfomance against Buffalo was nothing to right home about.  In fact, it was very similar to Beck's against the Jets.  The problem of trying to compare Lemon and Beck is that neither of them have had much of an opportunity to prove themselves under the overall conditions of the team.  

We have had a non-existant running game starting with the Eagle game (consiquently Beck's debut).  In Lemon's five games prior to handing over the starting job to Beck, he enjoyed rushing support of 137, 110, 179, 116, and 143 yards.  Beck takes over and enjoyed rushing support of 77, 49, and 37 yards.  Can we both agree that an ineffective running game lends to a bigger challenge for the passing game?  

Regarding the agrument that Beck has not led the Dolphins on a scoring drive.  I will use the Eagle game in his defense (I was there).  He
orchestrated a drive from within our own 10 yard line only to have feely miss a 47 yard field goal(short).  Later in the game we have 1st and goal from the 1 yard line.  The first attempt Chatman is stopped.  On second down a beautiful pass from Beck is DROPPED in the endzone by Halterman (hit him in the hands).  Third down Chatman is stopped.  We go for it with 6:47 left in the game trailing 17 to 7 and miss it.  If we take the field goal, we get within a score and still have time on the clock. That, my friend, is bone-head coaching and poor recieving! We dropped so many passes and the recievers weren't getting turned around in time.  

Beck is a victim (so is Lemon) of poor coaching decisions (play calling) and an ineffective run game.  It would be interesting to see how Beck performs if he would get more than 50 yards run support.      

by Thruthickandt on Dec 11, 2007 1:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Topics at hand
What really pisses me off is that the evidence is growing against Cam.  I think everyone knows I've been a huge proponent of Cam, but all these rumors just sound too much like the shit we've seen before.  Each week I lose a little confidence, even though his coaching decisions are getting a little better (the onside call was awesome, getting cleo out of the pocket was great, too bad he sucks).  Now he's just losing everything else.
I want so bad to have some consistency on this team.  A long term coach that can grow with this team.  Or at the very least an old coach and someone being groomed to take over.  I want Cam to be that guy so we don't start over yet again, but things are not looking good for him.  

I at least hope Randy Mueller isn't let go....especially for that pompus asshole Bill Parcells.

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 10:44 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Come on board Glid
There is plenty of room left. You can sit beside me, Nat, or even Matty I if you want.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 10:54 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I told myself....
last week at home against the jets was rock bottom. Then of course, the dolphins played another game and sink, if you can believe it, even lower.

I have to say, we have a full-scale mutiny here against cam. People say he's a nice guy, a good guy, etc but we are in this situation, this mutiny and dissension, in large part because of cam's inflexibility and unwillingness to bend. This from a guy who has not even won a single NFL game. <sigh>

At this point, I think we need this charade to be put to a stop, right now. We desperately need a little euthanasia to put an end to the cam experiment.

If the phins gave up 30+ to buffalo, a pop gun offense, how many will they give up to NE, 60?

I can never recall being so embarrassed of my team, as I am now.

by Natalya on Dec 10, 2007 11:05 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

how many will they give up to NE, 60?
In the 1st half. We gave up 42 to them in the 1st half at home, and thats when we were actually trying.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 11:18 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've given Cam the benefit of the doubt until now
Cam's handling (mishanlding) of the QB situation is a microcosm of his overall lack of management ability.  All along he his displayed no sign of a thoughtful plan, or consistency in executing it.  He  drafts Beck, and then has him running the scout team the whole first part of the season.  Even after Green gets hurt and it takes several weeks to get another QB in here so that Beck can finally get some more time running OUR offense.  

Then after 5 crappy starts by Lemon he puts Beck in but only give him like 5 different plays to run.  If Beck wasn't ready to handle the offense then he shouldn't have put him in in the first place.  And now he yanks Beck after 3 series and we're back to where we started, but worse because he's ruined Beck's confidence.  Great job for such a QB guru!

There has clearly been no plan, and no consistency with this guy.  He doesn't have the respect of his players and I agree with Matty that this will be a curse in free agency.  

by ithacadolphin on Dec 10, 2007 11:38 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

amen
you would have thought that the second green went down, he would have gotten Beck some snaps, just in case nope he left him running the scout team for what 3 more weeks?

On top of that don't forget, he annoint's beck the QB of the future.... then at camp he has to give cleo all these extra snaps, because there is suppose to be some uncertainty as to who the day 1 starter would be. Right, every one of those non green first team snaps should have gone to beck.

Then he makes cleo #2 for practice purposes, so beck's off to the scout team. If he makes Beck #2 at least beck gets some snaps during the week with the first team and gets to bond some. What did he have to lose, cleo know the offense and if green goes down he can put Cleo in....But now Beck has no connection to the starters. No chemistry and he and the teams future is suffering because of it.

Now compare that to Edwards in Buffalo. right away buffalo makes edwards #2. all in camp he gets 1st team experience, plus he gets meaningful time during preseason. edwards shows signs of being a QB, so they cut #2 Nall to give edwards snaps to accelerate his developement during the season. Now who looks like the better QB? Is there a difference in talent? who knows, was there a difference in the developement plan, you bet.

That is why some teams with marginal talent are 7-6 and others are 0-13.

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 10, 2007 9:33 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Decision
I actually thought the decision to pull Beck was a good one.  It was clear the O line wasn't getting it done and Lemon gives more mobility.  The play calling took advantage of that and they rolled him out all game long after that.  Problem was he lacks accuracy and ball handling.

I also don't think we've killed Beck's confidence yet.  But, the question remains about how much potential he has.  Cam's reluctance to insert Beck was absolutely correct, I really think he got pressured into the decision.  This half of the season would have been difficult for most any rookie QB, especially with the inclement conditions and some of the defenses.  I would have expected more during the Jets game, but we all saw how that turned out.  I think you need to leave him under center (at risk of 0-16) to see how he plays vs Bal and Cin, two defenses that have struggled of late.  The NE game is a wash, we should really F the league and just not show up!  I'm kidding of course.  Based on that, there's a decision to be made.  I think of this like the Charlie Frye situation Cleveland had a few yrs back, but I hope with better results from Beck.

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 11:51 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I can't believe what I'm reading
Truly you guys can't be ready to throw John Beck under the train after just 4 starts? Some of you, maybe even most of you, are thinking of the NEXT Dan Marino or I told you we should have picked Brady Quinn (another fire Cam/Randy reason). What you fail to remember is that Dan wasn't the starting QB his first year and he was playing on a team that, the year before, had gone to the SB (great talent). You need to be thinking of a team like Dallas and Troy Akman or the 49ers and Alex Smith (no talent). In fact, I bet, you could put Tom or Payton on this team and they would have a hard time getting a win. John Beck is going to be a good QB and if the Fins do the stupid thing and trade him, as some are saying, then I will NEVER be a dolfan again and I've been one since '66.

by gafinfan on Dec 10, 2007 11:57 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed!
Beck is not the problem. Cam was rushed into the situation, but it was his fault. With that said it was a good idea to pull him and go with Lemon at the time. Beck is still the QB of this teams future. If he isn't? Another wasted draft pick on a QB.

Marino played as a rookie half way through the season and went to the pro-bowl.

Matt

by Matt27 on Dec 10, 2007 1:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I disagree with
pulling Beck at Buffalo.  It did show us that Lemon did not do any better.  The only good thing about getting Beck out is if he performed like Lemon, he would be under a lot more heat.  With Lemons performance matching Becks against the Jets, why is he not getting the scrutiny?  Lemon is not a rookie so what was his excuse.  HMMMMM.
I agree Beck has a good future, hate to see the Dolphins squander it.  Cam had/has faith in him or he wouldn't have picked him up in the second round.  It is one thing to be a good drafter (which Cam did), but it takes a good coach and system to develop the player.  

by Thruthickandt on Dec 11, 2007 2:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Quinn
Quinn has nothing to do with Beck.  I don't want Quinn either.  He can't even beat out Derek Anderson.  He wasn't just passed by Cameron, he was passed by 20 other teams!  Hello?

by mred on Dec 10, 2007 6:56 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I absolutely agree with your thinking.
If the Dolphins think of trading him, I may consider doing the unthinkalbe as you have mentioned.  I am with the Dolphins thru thick and thin, but not thru stupidity.
Beck has what it takes but it won't show under these circumstances.  Thus the Beck bashing from the idiots will not stop.  
I mention in another entry the lack of run support.  In the three complete games Beck played, he got 77, 49, and 37 yards of rushing support.  He had a dropped touchdown pass against the Eagles that would have built not only his confidence, but also the teams.  
We need Beck in with better game planning and play calling.

by Thruthickandt on Dec 11, 2007 2:08 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Stay with Cam!
Well, count me as a Cam supporter.  I've been unhappy with his play calling at times, such as not taking some pressure off Beck by never running against the Jets.  He didn't make that mistake when Lemon was QB yesterday, but why he didn't give Beck the same benefit is baffling, unless the answer is simply that Beck is not ready for rolling out yet.  However, having watched Lemon's limitations in the NY Giants game, I don't see how he could have done as well as Beck did against Philly and Pittsburgh.  Against the Jets, he was a sitting duck, once it became clear our receivers couldn't catch and our backs couldn't run.  When he was in against the Bills, he (and Ginn, of course) seemed to be the only person on offense trying to do something.

Clearly the biggest weakness, by far, on this team is personnel, not coaching. Our receivers cannot consistently catch the ball, except Ginn and Peele.  M Booker skills are in severe decline; David Martin cannot catch or block.  L Booker and, suddenly, Hagen, however, are promising.  

 There are 4 serious contributors that have been drafted in the years before the 2007 draft: Carey, Crowder, Hadnot, Roth; 3 part-timers: Daniels, Jason Allen, Hagen; some hangers on, Wright, Alibi; 1 potential star: Brown.  Now look at 2007 alone: 2 serious contributors: Satelle; Mauia; 1 about to be serious contributor, Booker; 1 potential star: Ginn.  I'm leaving out Beck, although to me he's clearly the best passer we've had since Marino.  He will be a very good QB next year.

All of the good things that have happened this year have been because of Cam.  The collapse of the defense had nothing to do with him.  The offense has lost its backs, the receiving corps is in "transition" (see above), and the OL is doing remarkably well, considering.  

Cam is the future, and in fact, if you listen closely, this is precisely what the veterans are complaining about: that Cam is too focused on next year and this year is not a priority.  Looking at what he's accomplished, this is not a bad thing.  Getting another Jimmy Johnson/Dave Wannstedt would be a disaster.  This team and this draft reminds me a great deal of the late 60's when we were still bad even after adding Griese, Zonka, etc.  Another draft like the last one--and we have excellent picks--means a return to competitiveness next year and serious contention the year after that.

I don't blame Cam for looking hopeless at Philly, a game we would have won if our receivers could catch and our whiny defense would have not dropped interceptions, made a few tackles, and instead had teenage girl temper tantrums causing penalties and lack of focus.  Look at who's complaining, and ask what the hell they've done for this team--excepting Jason Taylor, who's played poorly this year--and their zero commitment to developing a future, our even supporting their team this year, and then look at who is not complaining, and ask who is going to make this team win next year and in the future. People are acting as if we had some sort of great team that Cam's ineptitude somehow destroyed.  It's ridiculous. Whatever good we have is from Cam and Mueller.

by jeff z on Dec 10, 2007 12:04 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed
Peter King opened his Monday Morning QB article with a great statement directed at the Dolphins. There needs to be some patience here. Cam is not going to turn this thing around in one year. Maybe he'll never do it, but you have to have some stability. He picked up a terrible roster and the only playmakers he had are hurt or traded. I would like to see what happens with another draft under his belt, and maybe a bit of house cleaning as we phase out of the Wannstedt/Saban solutions of signing stopgap veterans to pricey contracts and trading away draft picks. Remember how excited we were when we managed to get extra picks for Welker, Mare, and Chambers. Give these a chance to pan out, and the franchise might start to be run like the Patriots and Colts.

by nicholasriehl on Dec 10, 2007 12:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This wasn't terrible team he was taking over!!
There was supposed improvement this year.. you can complain about injuries and what have you, but they have looked bad from the get go. Whatever Cam needs our patience to turnaround he has done himself. This was 6-10 team that .500 was a very real possiblity for this year, not and expansion team.
The Jayfiss Report ...one fan's rants.

by NumberSeven on Dec 10, 2007 1:53 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Fish
There's always something. First it was, Cam is coming close , he'll win a game. Then we start gettin blown out. Then it was, look at what he is doing with our improved offense. Then the games get tight and exploits Cameron's play-calling and shows our offense still stinks. Then is was look at our O-line, how much he has improved it. How many sacks the past 2 games?  Finally it came down to "He still has the locker room", the players are still playing hard for Cam. Now we find out they are calling him a joke, and cussing him on and off the field. They don't have anything else.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 2:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This was a terrible team....
Offense:
No QB to work with. Trent Green was only brought in to tutor Beck. Nothing on the outside between M.Booker, who is very average, and the terrible TEs. Chambers has been inconsistent his whole career. It's a miracle we got a 2nd round pick for him. Remember when we couldn't get anything because of the DWI and huge contract. Cam has done a great job getting this line to be respectable (we're still a couple pieces away, but it's good progress). And Ronnie was having his best year ever under Cam.

Defense:
Porter was hurt the first half and is now showing up at times. They have no impact DT's. Traylor is old, fat, and slow. I haven't heard Roth's name in 2 months. Z.Thomas and Holliday have been hurt all year. There wasn't an above-average player in the secondary to begin with after W.Allen. Walk down the street in Pennsylvania and ask anyone if they've heard of M.Lehan, R.Hill, T.Daniels, C.Worrell, or T.Tillman. There isn't a lot to work with.  

I don't see how 0-13 can all be hung on Cam. Capers was having Porter cover TE's half the season and the talent that Saban left has gotten very old. Defense wasn't the focus of this off-season because it was expected to be solid again. Cam needs some time to turn this roster over with more youth and speed. Firing him and Mueller is only going to add to the mess and set us back further.

by nicholasriehl on Dec 10, 2007 4:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let's wait a sec
First off, this wasn't a "terrible" team. I don't know where all these people are getting off acting like Cameron took over a franchise team or something. This was a 6-10 team, bad yes, terrible no.

~Trent Green was only brought in to tutor Beck~

Green was borught into to tutor yes, but also win now. Thats what Cameron told Wayne, and thats why we signed Porter.

~I don't see how 0-13 can all be hung on Cam.~

Nope but I gave you the list earlier (scroll up) why he is a incompetent HC.

~Firing him and Mueller is only going to add to the mess and set us back further.~

Didn't say anything about firing Mueller, I think he has done a fine job in the draft and with the Chambers trade. Why do people assume these 2 are jointed at the hip?

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 11:32 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What a cotton picking minute!
Don't think I'm sending him under the bus at all.  I like this kid.  But we need to make sure he can do what we think he can do, because there is some talent available in next year's draft.  It's a football decision, it's the same way every year.  Don't think for a minute that same question didn't cross the mind of the GM's for the QB's you mentioned!  There should be no player safe on this team at this point.  I believe the talent is more to blame for 0-16 than the coaches, but these are questions that will be asked.  

You are correct though, we need to give Beck a chance and show some confidence in him.  I'd love to see a TD pass!

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 12:08 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've said nothing of John Beck...
this is a 7 game evaluation. 4 games down, 3 more to go. I'll give my opinion on him then.

Cam Cameron? I've been giving my opinion on him from the onset. He, unlike Beck, deserves not so much as one more second of being on this team.

Fire Cam.....Now.

by Natalya on Dec 10, 2007 12:14 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's always a race thing, isn't it?
Give me a break.  Race is a nonissue.  The bottom line is Cleo Lemon isn't very good.  We know what his ceiling is.  We don't know what Beck's ceiling is yet.

by Matty I on Dec 10, 2007 1:09 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cam supporters
Wow, I like all the Cam supporters showing up and saying something for once!

by Gliddog on Dec 10, 2007 1:14 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Without Objection
I am not joining the bandwagon yet, but I can't put up a fight against it.

I am against firing him without hiring a proven winner / rebuilder.

Cowher told CBS that he will not coach in 2008.

That leaves Marty.  That is it.  That is our list.  Maybe John Fox, but he is a reach.

by Mindtornado on Dec 10, 2007 1:22 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cowher told CBS that he will not coach in 2008
That maybe so, but eveyone listens when money has something to say.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 1:25 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No No No
If Cowher's heart isn't in it and he's just coming back to coaching in 08 because of a big payday, then I want no part of him.  That's just bad news waiting to happen.  And seriously, do you think Cowher needs money?  

I'd love to have Cowher is he wanted to be in Miami for reasons other than money.  But it's looking more and more like he isn't going to be an option.

by Matty I on Dec 10, 2007 2:25 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The End of Days for Cam
I am a supporter of giving a man a chance...ie CPep, Lemon, RW, and Cam. Though I preferred Tomlin I supported Cam, b/c he was an offensive coach who desired to get the ball out and down the field as often as possible. Cam has become a joke, our offense has no bit (and when it did it was running the ball earlier in the year). Cam had his chances...we may say you cant base firing someone after one year is wrong, but in a game where performance is a major component of once abilities and assessment of their future success. Cam has not developed or shown any consistency in any category from FA signings, to game planning, to handling the offense/being the head coach, and etc. I will be the first on to say would a 4-12, 1-15, 5-10 record make it any better, i would say not b/c those games could have all been won on luck or 1 big play. Something his coaching style is lacking....don't get me wrong players have their role as well, but come on now a player can only do so much when told to do something not in his character/position (ala J.Porter as a stand up LB all the time)

by 305finforlife on Dec 10, 2007 1:30 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

young team
i believe that finding a new coach could be easier than you think. We are heading into a massive draft, and there is going to be a lot of talent out there. A new coach will be able to draft players that will fit the system they install. Having choices, oppurtunities for trading picks, and perhaps even the chance of drafting a new franchise quarterback (even though i believe beck still holds that position) can really entice a coach to come to miami.

that being said...cam and the staff put together a good draft this year. There are a lot of contributors, and players are getting playing time and experience. This is one reason i like cam, but it is only one like compared to many dislikes.

whatever happens we are going to improve with all of the rookies developing... and honestly, we aren't going to get any worse right?

by sparkzor on Dec 10, 2007 2:14 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Fertile Grounds
Coach Cam can't win.  He has had 13 chances and... nothing.  In the end that is all that matters (winning games), and he doesn't.  What makes any of you think he will next year?

That said, I think we could get a good coach.  The 'phins need someone that can embrace the past and traditions of the program and get the team to perform in a consistent manner week in and week out.  Prime spot in the draft, location, and some talented youth should tempt anyone.

But why do you want a big-namer?  I think we should look for a guy that has proven his consistency in a college program and is young enough to stay for a good career (15+ years) if he starts having success in Miami.

Oh no, here we go!

by Riz on Dec 10, 2007 3:47 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Beck
Yes, I agree.  We will give Beck only 3 more games to finally decide to draft Matt Ryan.

by mred on Dec 10, 2007 6:57 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

until now....
first off let me say this is the most intelligent site on the Phins that I have found and I have read your discourse all year but felt fine reading until now....Point #1--Cam got all crazy before the season about not letting Ricky play as he betrayed the team and the city etc....then you let him play??? are you kidding...if you are a man of your word and conviction then no matter what your running back situation was that POS shouldn't have ever seen the field...honestly Cam lost me at that point.....In addition, IF you are an 0-12 team then your number one goal is to make damn sure your draft is good...you realize what you MUST get out of your #1 pick before anything else....in that vein you HAVE to evaluate Beck over the rest of the year...there is NO reason to play another QB unless Beck is hurt and I don't care if he throws 29 INTS....you have to get a good enough picture to know if QB is a high need area..the fact that Cam is not secure enough or has enough buy in to allow that to happen is reason enough to fire him....pulling Beck was stupid to begin with but not getting him ready to go back in again is insane.....the others on the team who are clamoring for a QB who gives them a better chance to win need to look in the friggin' mirror and ask where the wins were before Beck....A mutiny shouldn't be tolerated either and although a player like Taylor or Thomas should be granted a trade to play for a contender...ANY OTHER player needs to either improve his own game or find another job...the Jets and Bills have little to play for either but they are playing.......

by bigelboy on Dec 10, 2007 7:03 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let's wait it out...
Yeah< i know we suck and I mean big time.
  1. We have been depleted with injuries in some key positions. Some guys are playing hurt week to week.
  2. When we do make a big play (a rarity), we kick ourselves in the ass with penalties, stupid penalties I might add.
and 3. We are young in some key areas. Areas where we needed youth at. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Haven't we used 3 different qb's for the third year in a row. We've also had 5 coaches in the last 4 years.

How the hell can we win with the soap opera that has come to Miami since Marino retired.

by jtfinsfan1 on Dec 10, 2007 7:04 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cam
If the players have really quit on Cam, all bets are off. He has to go, and that's that.

On his behalf, i could say the Dolphins have been very unlucky. I read somewhere that Dolphin opponents have made an inordinate amount of FGs, for example, rarely missing from any distance.

 On the other hand, the team seems to be getting worse by the day. They weren't getting blown out like this by the Bills and Jets earlier in the season.

In conclusion, whether you like Cam or not, it's nothing personal, but he must go... UNLESS the Fins turn it around to end the year and put the mutiny romours to rest.

by icerob on Dec 10, 2007 7:25 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Honestly
I think Cameron is gone. Wayne is a guy who listens to the media (hell he even asked for their advice once) and everywhere he turns they are bashing the Dolphins, Cameron, and going on how the players hate him. Not to mention 0-16. I see in no way Wayne keeps him.

by Neo on Dec 10, 2007 11:46 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

unless of course
he reads peter king and some of the other SI writers.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/peter_king/12/09/week14/index.html

then we have Cam II, the horor returns, and based on what wayne did with wanny, can you honestly say it isn't 50/50 Cam's back? I'll back track a little and say wanny did have veterans like Zack and JT behind him as opposed to openly calling for his ouster.

fingers crossed.

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 11, 2007 12:04 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cam II, the horror returns
I'm not paying to see that sequal. I thought they were trying to cut down violence on TV? BTW, that NE/Maimi game should be rated TV: MA Mature Audience Only..graphic violence (V), (and from what I hear about the players) crude indecent language (L). -)

by Neo on Dec 11, 2007 12:59 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

nah
the first half maybe, but NE should have home field locked up, and it's unlikely that the starters would play the whole game....

unless, of course, they need to add an asterisk

by W NY Fins Fan on Dec 11, 2007 11:00 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Get the fuck out of here
Race has nothing to do with this.

by Patssuck456 on Dec 11, 2007 7:53 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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