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Do the Dolphins really need a wide receiver?

Many Dolphin fans out there are sincerely hoping that the Dolphins spend a day one draft pick - especially that 25th overall pick - on a wide receiver.  Many of the so-called "draft experts" are predicting in their mocks that the Dolphins will select a receiver.  But you can count me in the minority who feel that a wide receiver, at this point, is more of a luxury than a need.  And I don't think you take luxuries in round one unless you can afford to.  I don't think the Dolphins can afford to.

KC Joyner - author of Scientific Football each year and known more affectionately as "The Football Scientist" because of his statistical breakdowns of the game - seems to agree with me on this one.  In his latest blog entry for the NY Times, Joyner writes about how he feels the Dolphins need a corner and not a receiver.

Joyner presents his stats in this article in regards to Miami's top three receivers - Ted Ginn, Greg Camarillo, and Davone Bess.  About Ginn, Joyner points out how his 8.8 yards per attempt in 2008 ranked him 18th in the entire NFL (out of receivers with at least 80 attempts).  Joyner also adds that Ginn "doesn’t need stat gimmicks to show that he truly is that good and has the skills to be a solid #1."

Turning his attention to Camarillo, Joyner points out that his specialty, short passes, is where Greg really stands out.  He had a success rate of 87.7% in 2008 in the "short depth range" - ranking him 2nd in the entire NFL.

But Joyner's comments and stats on Davone Bess intrigued me the most:

If those two weren’t enough, the Fins also have Davone Bess. Bess’s specialty was medium passes, where his 11.2 YPA on 21 passes put him in similar company to some much bigger names – Lee Evans (25 attempts, 283 yards, 11.3 YPA), Greg Jennings (34 attempts, 377 yards, 11.1 YPA) and Eddie Royal (22 attempts, 252 yards, 11.5 YPA). Bess has a tremendous understanding of pass offenses that he picked up while playing for June Jones in Hawaii, so his upside with experience could also be a lot higher.

OK - so I'm aware that many of you don't like reading into statistical analysis.  But these numbers have to mean something, don't they?  I think that they do.  I think they highlight the depth of Miami's receiving core.  And we didn't even talk about Brandon London - who this regime is very high on and who I personally feel is going to be a factor in 2009.

And there's one other myth I want to dispel - the one that claims how the Dolphins are in so much need of a receiver who can "make things happen" after the catch.  In 2008, the Dolphins ranked 15th in the NFL in reeiving yards after the catch - with 1,612 yards.  The Packers ranked first in YAC - with 2,294.  Two interesting points here.  First off, the teams who finished in the top 5 in YAC failed to make the playoffs.  Meanwhile, the Cardinals ranked 14th, with just 4 more yards than the Dolphins, while the Steelers ranked 31st in the league, with 318 fewer yards than the Dolphins.

I don't know about you, but I know that what I take from these numbers is that the wide receiver position really isn't as bad as everybody is making it out to be.  While another playmaker would be fun and make the team better, I think that Miami's defensive needs are far more pressing.

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Couldn't agree more - but wait, there's more!

I have to admit I’m a long time reader but very rare commenter, but you’re right on Matty. I’m glad to see you’re addressing it considering the fins are mentioned in this post on PFT, saying that it is “uknown whether Miami will get into the mix.”

I think the other thing thats great about Camarillo and Bess is that they match up to some of the best and NEITHER were drafted – just goes to show how much talent is available at WR at the lower rounds if you know what to look for.

As much as I would love Anquan on this team I say no way to a 1 and 3, he’s about to be on the wrong side of 30 and we have too many needs to spend 2 picks on 1 player even if he’s a proven commodity (btw he himself was a 2nd round pick.)

I just don’t see Parcells spending a first on a receiver when we need so much help still on D.

Keep up the good work and thanks for being a solid place i can come on the daily to get the good stuff!

by winplease on Apr 16, 2009 2:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree

Unless we can get anquan, I think we should take a corner at 25.

Ted Ginn is the man.

by topspin on Apr 16, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

100% agreed

The reason Ginn got drafted so high(although he does take lots of flack for being a top 10 pick even though it’s not his fault) was becasue of his speed. Before Camarillo got hurt, he was putting up some good numbers. WR start performing in year 3 which is this year for Ginn. Also, with the production of Bess and Fasano…we can find a WR to battle Ginn in round 3 or 4.

If you look at Edwards and the amount of drops he had, those are drive killers. It puts you into 2nd or 3rd and long. I’d rather take the short 5 yard pass with 4-5 YAC. It keeps our DEF fresh and theirs tired. This is why late in the games last year, you felt like we were almost never out of it.

If we have more oppurtunites on offence we’ll score more points and the way you do that is with a solid DEF. We need a ball-hawk at the corner position to reduce the opposing #1 WR looks. This delays the QB’s decisions and gives our D/Ends more time to get to him. We also need a OLB to help stuff the run and we’re good.

Matti you rule.

I LOVE THIS TEAM

by Polephin on Apr 16, 2009 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

200%...

"You are the people you hang out with"

by buckeyebill on Apr 17, 2009 1:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good Read

I read that article just a little while ago and have to say that the stats are pretty convincing. I was particularly encourage by the Ginn stats. His progression seems to be right in line for a #1 receiver.
The problem Miami has is that none of their receivers are big name guys. They are not stars. So because we don’t have the big name guy, the perception is that we need a wide receiver. I don’t think so. The stats speak for themselves.

by 13FinsFan on Apr 16, 2009 2:09 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

great but...

maybe the Steelers made greater gains at point of reception, as do the Cards and so have recievers who can get there in the first place. They don’t need to make up so much yardage after the catch. If we had recievers who could get open further down field and a QB that could get it there then it might be more interesting.

However, Im talking out my ass as I don’t have stats to back this up. Nevertheless, I am not in favor of a stud WR in rd 1.

Butler Brace Barwin & Barden: 4Bs or not 4Bs, that is da Q

by Corroncho on Apr 16, 2009 2:09 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

We have Ginn for that

What you are talking about is speed. The critics said Ginn was the fastest player they have seen since Daryl Green. Yes I know the knock on him is he may get bumped on the line but receivers get over that.

by Polephin on Apr 16, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

great but...

maybe the Steelers made greater gains at point of reception, as do the Cards and so have recievers who can get there in the first place. They don’t need to make up so much yardage after the catch. If we had recievers who could get open further down field and a QB that could get it there then it might be more interesting.

However, Im talking out my ass as I don’t have stats to back this up. Nevertheless, I am not in favor of a stud WR in rd 1.

Butler Brace Barwin & Barden: 4Bs or not 4Bs, that is da Q

by Corroncho on Apr 16, 2009 2:09 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good Post

All valid points that point to the fact we’re not taking a WR in rd 1. Im hoping we trade down a few spots to pick up extra pks. Im also hopin that the Giants dont make a play for Boldin and Edwards so that maybe they’ll trade with us. We Love Nicks giants fans(smokescreens) baby

by drey34 on Apr 16, 2009 2:12 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I like the statistical analysis.

The biggest question is simply, do they get the job done? Stats show they do.
Thing is I really think London will be a good reciever, so even if the phins don’t even select one reciever in the draft I think we’ll be better at the position next year with London starting.

"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."
-Hunter S. Thompson

by Daren on Apr 16, 2009 2:19 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

All defense

I am pretty happy with our options at top 4 Wr, and am comfortable we can find a 5th later in the draft or undrafted.

I think the first day of the draft should be spent entirely on defense.

Creator of the 'Draft Clay Matthews Jr.' bandwagon.
"The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent." - John Maynard Keynes

by Patrick Bateman79 on Apr 16, 2009 2:28 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

If a WR drafted who gets cut?

I know I really like Brandon London, as do many, but others outside the DolFans think he is just a fan favorite who is the odd ball out to get cut. We know the cap hit Wilford carries and that Ginn, Greg, and Bess are not on the chopping block this year so London is the odd man out. However you have to think of it in another way, London is still young, has a lot of up side and has a year under his belt with the offense. To me that gives him the upper edge on any WR drafted.

Many including myself like Kenny Britt as a WR in the NFL, and compares very similar to London. From watching Britt at Rutgers, I know hes a beast at the point of attack and have not seen to much on London, but to me the knowledge London has is a great advantage over Britt. Any receiver the Phins have right now will most likely be as productive as any rookie this year, and allows them to address another need. A rookie, may help in the long run, but WR is sold now until the rest of the team is built!

The Patriots Suck

by k2oconnor on Apr 16, 2009 2:45 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Tough question

He would be the odd man out.. Wilford really makes me angry. But you kinda gotta keep him in tow atleast through preseason just to be sure. Guys, a true number one reciever opens it up for the others in so many ways. The thing that bothered me last year wasn’t the yards or catches by our recievers. it was the touchdown or lack there of. Again, a number one opens that up to.

"No matter where you go, there you are" ~ Buckaroo Banzai

by Jersquall on Apr 16, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wilford

He has the physical abilities to me a force on the field, height, strength and toughness. However he has a lack on concentration with dropping the ball and not allowing himself to be coachable. I heard he is making and effort to get better and be productive again. He can step in and really open it up for the offense. I am not 100% done with him yet… yet

The Patriots Suck

by k2oconnor on Apr 16, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wilford or London

IMO if we draft a first day receiver, which we probably will (my guess with the second pick in round two), then London or Wilford will be gone once the season starts. Wilford to me seems the most likely (cap hit or not) since he has been such a disappointment. If not him then London would be the guy.

#13

by 13FinsFan on Apr 16, 2009 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

True

I think us DolFans are really high on London more than many others looking in, but he taking the time to chat on this site really went the distance.

The Patriots Suck

by k2oconnor on Apr 16, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Other NFL teams are high on London, though

the Giants were unhappy when we snatched him off their practice squad and surely regret it now. I also remember reading that at least 10 other teams put in claims for London – but we had the waiver priority over them all.

So while other fans outside of Miami might not know him, the NFL definitely does.

by Matty I on Apr 16, 2009 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How bout this

Fins have 5 WR on the Roster, and as I stated carrying 6 is not likely. How bout taking Pat White as the WR in a later round, and make the Wild Cat a bigger threat! I know people have touched on this earlier this off season, but I think this could work more and more

The Patriots Suck

by k2oconnor on Apr 16, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

you would have to get White at 56

and just look at the 56 pick in Mocking The Draft. Matty took A. Smith come on a part time WC player that is a practise squad WR or a potential rookie starting CB who at worst is our nickel back. I hope White isn’t picked by us anywhere near our firat 5 picks

25th pick - Clay Mathews LB USC
44th pick - Alphonso Smith cb Wake Forest
56th pick - Clint Sintim LB Virginia
86th pick - Fili Moala DT USC

by Blaze453 on Apr 16, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

eh

Did not want him in the 2nd but if he comes in the 3rd would not be opposed, again it is a luxury pick and would be exciting, I would not use Pat at WR, Just thinking

The Patriots Suck

by k2oconnor on Apr 16, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

One Thing Not Mentioned Is Value At the Pick

I never expected them to draft a WR with that first pick. My target for a WR is actually the 2nd pick in the 2nd round. However, if Hakim Nicks is there at #44, I think he is too good to pass up. With the 2nd pick in rnd 2 I would be fine with taking a Robiskie or Britt, because they are good value at that point. If we can get a CB & LB with the first two picks, barring a Nicks scenario where he is available at #44, I’ll be happy with that.

by dab415217 on Apr 16, 2009 2:57 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Also, I'm in Disagreement Regarding Bess.

I know I am in the minority here, but I think we’ve seen the best that Bess can give us. He’s a mentally gifted WR, which is why I believe we’ve seen is best. He’s the antithesis of London, not physically gifted, but knows the WR position and how to get open. Those types of players reach their ceiling early. I think Bess is tha type of player.

I’m not sold on London yet, otherwise he would’ve seen the field more last year with the injuries and sucking (Wilford) there was at the WR position. Call me cautious. He’s physically gifted, but needs to learn the position better. Again, the opposite of Bess.

Camarillo is the guy I am highest on of anyone outside of Ginn. If he fully recovers from his injury, I believe he will be a topflight slot WR.

I’d like another guy to go with this group, i.e. Nicks/Robiskie/Brett et al just to round this group out. Then we’ll have a very good, YOUNG WR corps.

by dab415217 on Apr 16, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree

Wes Welker was the same type of player bess is and even though Welker was fast, Bess is faster. Much faster. Stupid fast. He has excellant fundamentals-great hands, understands his routes and wants the ball and hangs on it.

I will say that Welker seemed to be tough then Bess though. However, that only matters in fumbles. If they both hang on to the ball, it’s a mood point.

Although Bess will not catch 100 passes because our offence is structured differently he will get better. CP or Henne will get comftorable with a guy like that becasue he is a sure thing. He’ll start using his speed soon and be able to make things happen after the catch.

He’ll be a great player.

by Polephin on Apr 16, 2009 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Better check your facts. Wes Welker is actually faster than Bess

Now, if you’re referring to quickness (I’d say they are even) or change of direction (may have a little on him), but in flat-out speed, you are incorrect.

by dab415217 on Apr 16, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

SLAP

-"I'll weather whatever storm, Make it out without a bruise"
-"Even when winning illogical, losing is still far from optional"
-"Even the greatest gotta suffer sometime"
-"No excuses, No explanations"

by MiamihastheDolphins.... on Apr 16, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

not what i read

I read it in about Novevember. I’ll try and find the article. But it referenced speed and change of direction as well.

by Polephin on Apr 16, 2009 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Even if Bess has reached his ceiling,

he is still a fantastic WR averaging just under 6 catches/game started and 11.5 YPC. Extrapolate that and you get approximately 96 receptions and over 1000 yards for the season. Would those numbers satisfy you on any other receiver?

And guess what? The odds that he’s already topped out are pretty slim considering he’s A ROOKIE.

by joel311 on Apr 16, 2009 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ditto my friend

Butler Brace Barwin & Barden: 4Bs or not 4Bs, that is da Q

by Corroncho on Apr 16, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ditto my friend

Butler Brace Barwin & Barden: 4Bs or not 4Bs, that is da Q

by Corroncho on Apr 16, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Draft a CB

I’m with matty! We have decent WR and very questionable CB!!

GEtSICK 4 JC

by GEtSICK13 on Apr 16, 2009 3:21 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The thing with looking at these numbers in relative isolation...

is that we potentially lose sight of how they affect other aspects of our offense – for instance, our running game and how defenses gameplan against us.

For example, last year during the entire season, CP10 threw a grand total of 9 passes that traveled 31 yards or more. Let’s compare that to a number of other QB’s:

Matty Ryan, 23 passes
Phillip RIvers, 24 passes
Matt Cassell, 20 passes
Tony Romo, 28 passes
Peyton Manning, 28 passes
Drew Brees, 32 passes
and even Jeff Garcia, a guy with a noodle arm of his own, tossed 18 passes (twice that of CP-10) of 31+ yards.

What that tells me is that as an opposing defensive coordinator is that against the dolphins, I have a smaller area to defend and can shift my focus towards shutting down the run and defending the short-to-intermediate passing game. A good enough defense will do that, successfully against us, more times than not and I think both baltimore games illustrated this.

So do the dolphins need a receiver? I still think they do. Not to mention in the long term a QB that can consistently throw every route in the passing playbook.

by Natalya on Apr 16, 2009 3:40 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I don't think that

Some people try to find things in this game that don't exist but football is only two things - blocking and tackling. ~Vince Lombardi

by ratenxs on Apr 16, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think that's the fault of the WRs though

Ted Ginn can stretch the field, CP-10 just can’t get it to him.

Some people try to find things in this game that don't exist but football is only two things - blocking and tackling. ~Vince Lombardi

by ratenxs on Apr 16, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exhibit A

“Not to mention in the long term a QB that can consistently throw every route in the passing playbook.”

by Natalya on Apr 16, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That being said....

I still don’t think we could, in our right minds, pass up on Harvin or Nicks if they fell to #44.

Some people try to find things in this game that don't exist but football is only two things - blocking and tackling. ~Vince Lombardi

by ratenxs on Apr 16, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i dunno

is that a WR issue or a QB issue?

we have the guy who can stretch the field.

by Matty I on Apr 16, 2009 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Matty...

how about both?

The best receivers are dangerous all over the field, not just on the deep routes. That, I think, is what we don’t have – a receiver who can hit the home run whether he catches a 5 yard curl or a 50 yard go.

Naturally you need someone who can make all the throws to said #1 receiver..

by Natalya on Apr 16, 2009 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's the point I've been making

we have nice WR’s who each do one thing very well (Ginn blows by people, Camarillo is always reliable underneath, Bess is a lightning quick slot receiver, and London has the size and length we want).. but, put yourself in the opposing D-Coordinator’s shoes and tell me if you’re legitimately scared of any of them beating you.

Chances are, unless you’re an unabashed homer incapable of being rational, you said no. I know if I was going up against Miami, I’m not scared of the WR’s. Ginn is a deep threat, yes, but you can easily take the deep ball away, and then the threat is gone and Ginn is average at best. Bess is incredible underneath, but I’m not gameplanning to stop Davone Bess from catching 5 yard passes.

Look at New England. Wes Welker catches 100 passes a year. Does anybody really think he’s THAT good? That’s Elite good, and Welker is not an elite WR. But, he benefits greatly from defenses being scared shitless of Randy Moss, and taking the lesser of two evils approach, making Brady beat them with Welker instead of Moss. No defense will take that approach against us.

the YAC stat is nice, but think back and try to remember how many of those runs-after-catches resulted in big play touchdowns. We have good players, Ted Ginn, Camarillo, Bess, they’re good WR’s, but none of them is an every-situation go to guy, or a guy that is a realistic threat to score every single time he gets near a football.

by Little Nicky 21 on Apr 16, 2009 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well Said

The phins don’t have a player on the outside that threatens a defense. You could see that in the way the Ravens played the phins on defense. Their safeties at time were 8 yards off the LOS at the snap. That is why Leonard and Reed could make tackles at the LOS on running plays. If the phins had one WR that could take a slant to the house, those safeties could play that tight.

by ct1361 on Apr 16, 2009 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

several points here

i’ll start with the easy one – yes welker IS that good. one of the big reasons the offense was ok with harrington at QB and stunk the next year… but that ship sailed so we’ll move on and grind our teeth twice a year….

next as to all our recievers doing one thing well… not one of them can block which is a BIG hinderance especially when as Nat points out, you start a QB that the defense only has to defend part of the field against. makes running nearly impossible.

as to the quality of the receivers – other than as blockers – they are a dang good unit that is honestly being held back by the limitations of the QB… if you get a QB in there who can hit Ginn deep, yes you can take that away by droping the LB’s and the safeties deeper which gives the slot and under guys more room to roam and use their elusiveness (read that as bess)

So while I would like to have at least ONE receiver (well besides that willow/vincelow/wilfort??? guy ) who can block, the unit is pretty dang good and you only have to look up the drop numbers to see that (btw-take a look at welkers numbers there and then tell me he’s not elite)

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 16, 2009 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll state my position again.

Sure, its ok to say that we “need” and corner and that wr is a “luxury.” However, if we have a chance at a top tier WR at 25 and we can get a CB in the 2nd round who’s almost as good as anyone we could get at 25, we should draft the wr at 25. The draft is about making your team better for the future, not necessarily filling needs that year that they are drafted.

"If anything goes bad, I did it. If anything goes semi-good, we did it. If anything goes really good you did it. That's all it takes to get people to win football games for you."

Coach Paul Bear Bryant

by AussieKen on Apr 16, 2009 4:27 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

right

and I’m a firm believer that Vontae Davis and Darius Butler (I won’t add Sean Smith here because i’m probably in the minority with how much I like him) both present better value at 25 than any WR outside of Crabtree and Maclin.

by Matty I on Apr 16, 2009 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Britt is going to be a beast

You know him better than I do.

"If anything goes bad, I did it. If anything goes semi-good, we did it. If anything goes really good you did it. That's all it takes to get people to win football games for you."

Coach Paul Bear Bryant

by AussieKen on Apr 16, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nicks is a want...

our offense needs a starting gaurd, depth at all offensive line positions, and a running back to get some experience behind Ricky and Ronnie while we still have them.

If Nicks is there at #44, whick I don’t believe he will be, we have to draft him. Chad Henne with Nicks, Ginn, and a playmaking tight end would be awesome in a couple of years.

by Phishenstein on Apr 16, 2009 4:43 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

dude

i have been thinking the same thing…i really don’t think we need to draft a WR in the 1st round, or even the 1st day, and i will be angry is we select one in the 1st round…we have more pressing needs, such as LB, CB, or D-Line…we have very capable receivers in Ginn, Bess, Camarillo, Brandon Landon is capable of being something special IMO, as well as Ernest Wilford (if he ever makes the field)…we have a good mix of speedsters and size, and i really think we should elsewhere with our first pick…

-"I'll weather whatever storm, Make it out without a bruise"
-"Even when winning illogical, losing is still far from optional"
-"Even the greatest gotta suffer sometime"
-"No excuses, No explanations"

by MiamihastheDolphins.... on Apr 16, 2009 5:06 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Since I joined The Phinsider

I have said that not only did I like our WR group that still hasn’t reached their ceiling BUT most importantly the FO does. WR will NOT NOT NOT be a pick of any of our first 5 choices unless something crazy happens and unbelievable value falls to one of those first 5 picks at the WR position

25th pick - Clay Mathews LB USC
44th pick - Alphonso Smith cb Wake Forest
56th pick - Clint Sintim LB Virginia
86th pick - Fili Moala DT USC

by Blaze453 on Apr 16, 2009 5:27 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good draft

I like your thinking. Clay Matthews is the type of linebacker that Parcells likes because of his versatility. Also as Mike Mayock pointed out, if Alphonso Smith was 2 to 4 inches taller, then he would be a top ten pick in this year’s draft. I also think that they will seriously look at a tight end, since both Fasano and Martin will be free agents after the upcoming season.

by sundevil11 on Apr 16, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Corner or OLB first

I agree with most of the comments that have been made. Also do not forget, CP10 will be able to practice with our current WR’s for an entire offseason. Imagine how much better they will be. Timing and practice are critical for QB’s & WR’s. We need corners to cover the 3 and 4 man sets teams are using nowadays and I have some serious doubts about all of our corners except for Will Allen. Great article Matty!

by sundevil11 on Apr 16, 2009 5:28 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

u go to ASU???

-"I'll weather whatever storm, Make it out without a bruise"
-"Even when winning illogical, losing is still far from optional"
-"Even the greatest gotta suffer sometime"
-"No excuses, No explanations"

by MiamihastheDolphins.... on Apr 16, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ASU

Not now. I graduated from there in 1985. When I was there, the Sundevil Defense gave up some where between 150 to 175 yards per game. On that team was Jim Jeffcoat, Vernon Maxwell, Mike Richardson, David Fulcher, Brian Noble and on offense we had Ron Brown and Randall Mc Daniel.

by sundevil11 on Apr 16, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

nice

i currently go to ASU…now we have….hmmm give me a minute for this….lol

-"I'll weather whatever storm, Make it out without a bruise"
-"Even when winning illogical, losing is still far from optional"
-"Even the greatest gotta suffer sometime"
-"No excuses, No explanations"

by MiamihastheDolphins.... on Apr 16, 2009 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Draft need

Hear me out. We’re going to sign JT after the draft. We’re trying to give the idea that we might draft a LB. By not signing JT till after the draft it leaves an opening that we might draft a LB. If we sign JT before the draft it takes away one of our “needs”. I think alot of teams out there feel that one of our biggest needs is at LB. I think we can go another year with what we have with or without JT.

By not signing JT it will allow us to pick from either a solid CB or a solid receiver. However, a top tier receiver will fall to the 25th pick such as Hakeem Nicks and I have a feeling our team doesn’t see much of a dropoff in talent from rounds one to two in cb. BPA will be Hakeem-Nicks. Nicks will be in year two while Henne takes over. Makes me drool.

by Dizzi00 on Apr 16, 2009 5:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

not a bad thought

but i say we still draft LB even if we plan on signing JT, cause JT won’t be with us for very long

-"I'll weather whatever storm, Make it out without a bruise"
-"Even when winning illogical, losing is still far from optional"
-"Even the greatest gotta suffer sometime"
-"No excuses, No explanations"

by MiamihastheDolphins.... on Apr 16, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hakeem Nicks

I think he would do wonders for this team!

by MassFinFan65 on Apr 16, 2009 6:06 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

BP won't grab a WR

I don’t see Parcells grabbing a WR when this group was, at the very least, solid last year. The last time he grabbed a WR at #1, she was a real headache.

by icerob on Apr 16, 2009 6:19 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

BP May Suprise You!

Why else would he bring Henne along to throw to Nicks?

by MassFinFan65 on Apr 16, 2009 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

:)

You mean… he wants for them to start becoming friends? :)

Seriously, these guys are too smart to tip their hand on a thing like that.

by icerob on Apr 20, 2009 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

London isn't going anywhere....

Everyone seems to forget that he just received a contract extension this off-season…I love Hakeem Nicks, though….I saw this interview with Ireland the other day and he was saying how if one person likes someone and the others disagree, they prove there point by watching film and doing some convincing…That’s why i think that the trifecta went to Chapel Hill to work out Nicks….to convince everyone that he was worthy of a first round draft pick..

by scbrandon on Apr 16, 2009 6:36 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I've made this point elsewhere, but this seems like a good place for it as well..

3rd and short, who are we throwing it to? If I’m on defense, I’m guessing Bess or Camarillo, and I’m probably right.

2nd and short, who should you look for? Many teams like to take a home run shot on 2nd and short, so if I’m on defense, the only home run threat on the field is Ginn, so that’s who I’m looking for.

Inside the 10, where’s the ball going? There’s only one guy who’s a candidate for a jump ball, so I’m gonna keep my eye on London.

Yes, we have good WR’s, and yes, the YAC and YPA look pretty good, but we have guys that are good in certain situations, and not so good in others. We don’t have a WR to force the defense into bad sets because he can house it on any play in any situation. I like our WR’s don’t get me wrong, but I don’t think we’re set at that position, and I still don’t see a guy who strikes fear in anyones heart. That’s what I want.

by Little Nicky 21 on Apr 16, 2009 6:45 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The problem with your argument is that

you complete disregard our squad of TEs. David Martin has proven to be a great deep threat and Fasano has proven quite reliable in short/medium yardage situations.

Oh wait, let’s not forget our RBs! Ricky Williams and Ronnie Brown caught many passes last season, and Patrick Cobbs went deep! I know you saw that Houston game.

In a given situation, the defense cannot pinpoint a single “go to guy” when we have so many options on our t-e-a-m.

by joel311 on Apr 16, 2009 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

NOP thats completely off-topic

you are actually making his argument stronger. What Nicky says is that we have a LOT of guys who can do some stuff really well -YES including deep-threat-martin – but we dont have a guy who can drive defenses nuts and coordinartors as well. We dont have that #1 receiver. Look at the past Super Bowl champions and contenders=

Indy- Marvin Harrison
Pats- Randy Moss
Giants= Plaxico Burres
Arizona= Fitzgerald

and on and on.
So if we want to be true contenders with Henne under center, we really need to get a true numer one receiver.

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 17, 2009 2:16 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not really.

We have plenty of guys that are great. If you have two Randy Moss’, do you lack a true #1 because there isn’t just one guy on your team that the other team has to plan for?

We have a lot of great which prevents the other team from assuming where we are going with the ball.

by joel311 on Apr 17, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

With the exception of Fitzgerald...

You illustrated the opposite of the point you’re trying to make, I think. By agreeing with Nicky, you’re saying that those receivers do everything as a number one receiver. Fitzgerald does everything, from being the burner, to the over the middle guy, to the guy who can take a short pass the distance. Randy Moss doesn’t go over the middle, that’s Welker’s job. Burress isn’t really a burner, he’s big receiver that can jump, nobody’s really worried about his double move, he’s just a physical specimen at receiver, but he still doesn’t go over the middle, that was Toomer’s job. Harrison, never goes over the middle, that’s what the Colt’s slot receiver of the year does. Every example of receiver does one thing very, very well. Not everything. You game plan for each receiver for their specific “job” on the team as the receiver. What makes Fitzgerald, probably the best receiver in the NFL right now, is that there isn’t one facit of his game that is excellent, everything he does, he does great. He’s a true threat, everywhere on the field. There’s no receiver in the Draft outside the top 2 WR’s that will fulfil that, so that’s why we should go defense…i.e. DB, LB

by Cokes_03 on Apr 17, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your argument isnt bad or anything HOWEVER

AGAIN, what Nicky and I mean, (im pretty sure nick haha) is that no pass offense can get to be stelar with out a true STAR WR. All the other guys you mentioned do is complement their #1 WR. Meaning that in order for them to be succesful they need all the factors a #1 WR provide. Things like double coverage (this benefits guys like Anquan Boldin), safeties playing deep (this benefits TEs and slot guys like Bess), nickel packages (benefits running game) and on and on.

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 17, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What do you call the Patriots..

passing offense before Moss shows up. I thought it was still “stellar.” He just made it better. You don’t need a star receiver to move the chains and score. Did you ever play football?

by Cokes_03 on Apr 21, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

EXACTLY that basically illustrates everything

Do we HAVE to get a WR on 25? no
Do we NEED a true #1 receiver eventually? yes

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 17, 2009 2:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How?

How does one WR in this years draft guarantee “fear” in the eyes of the opposing defenses? You see so many teams with an amazing beast receiver, but the team still lacks to win, either because the defense sucks, or that guy is double covered. No receiver in this draft (aside from crabtree and maclin) will demand double coverage right away. The Dolphins have a good group of WR’s, and dont forget how much the TE’s contributed last year. CB is the need, and I can almost guarantee a WR will not be picked at 25, even the 2nd round is a waste in m opinion.

I went to Ricky Williams high school!

by Dolphinsfreak34 on Apr 16, 2009 7:35 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree completely.

Our receivers are not just good, they’re great. I said as much in a recent fanpost, but the reaction to mine was much different.

by joel311 on Apr 16, 2009 8:49 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

do we need a wr? sure...

but do we need to get one now? no. i say to let our wr’s develop now. ginn is still learning, has showed flashes of what he could be, and bess is gonna be awesome for years to come… enter a healthy camarillo, we got oursleves a squad. nothing like the pats or indy’s with wayne, gonzalez, and when they had harrison…. but theres definitely a “safe” set of receivers playing in aqua.
I say safe because i dont see any of these receivers posting numbers like fitzgerald or andre johnson every week. one week it may be ginn— the next bess, always changing, and that inconsistency of whos gonna be the #1 target each week may be just as effectiv as having a dominant pro bowl WR. put one good corner on the guy, he’s not as good… but put one good corner on miami, and theres still two- three options who still could put up good, effective, numbers.

El Peezy... "the Calvin Johnson of rookies.. instant impact" -Prime Time
"el peezy strikes fear in opponent bloggers hearts" -finsx

by el presidente 00 on Apr 16, 2009 10:25 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

We need a lot of things, WR just happens to be included

This appears to be a good WR draft (to be seen in the future). Camarillo is coming off an injury, I don’t even remember where he got injured, but who knows what happens next. Ginn, from the seasons I’ve watched him play, is afraid of getting hit, unless he changes his mentality he is just a solid-great #2 WR. Bess is a solid #3 WR. Camarillo was playing #1 caliber play. So we have all solids (maybe a weak #1 with Camarillo, but he is still probably one of the best 30 WR, haven’t really checked or anything). Average WR core. Why did we lose against Baltimore? I personally thought we got sacked too fast (meaning we need to build up the OL if there is a top 5 guy up there). We obviously need Cornerbacks.
If we get a potential #1 WR in the draft, we would have 2 potentially #1s and a good-great-potentially#1, but still #2 WR. But who is going to throw, we still don’t have that many picks, I like Pennington and his style. I guess this changed my mind. Go OL not WR, if there is a top 2 CB there go for it.

I guess I should have thought twice before creating my profile's name.

by Beck4Mercy on Apr 16, 2009 10:48 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

i'm torn here

and as i’ve frequently stated over the last 6 months… the recievers are pretty dang good. there were hardly any drops, let alone meaningful ones, last year. these guys made tough catches in tight spots, often on high floaters that got them rung up (and yes i do mean mssr martin who deserved a purple heart for the passes he caught from CP last year)…

but the deep passes to ginn and YAC numbers were likely high because that is how defenses (well maybe not denver but then again they didnt play defense last year) lined up against miami… they threw everything into the line to stop the R&R and risked the big play (ala cobbs/bess beating a cb and going for 60)…

now having said that the receivers pretty much stunk in the red zone…. and that is really the crux – they haven’t shown either the size/toughness to push offcreate space or the quickness to hit the open spots in the zone…. but how much of that is the recievers or the fact that the red zone is one of those areas where a weak armed QB is exposed…

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 16, 2009 11:24 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

one more thing to add

when i compare teams – i like to look at what players would start on the other team as a way to get a handle on how the teams match up …. and setting the defense(s) aside lets look at how Pittsburgh and Miami match up….

and by that i mean which players on pittsburgh would start on miami….

well maybe i’m a homer, but there are only 4 – QB, RG (EK stunk and likely wouldn’t have played for pittsburgh’s woeful line), and the two WR’s… yet with that in mind – Pittsburgh was/is able to dominate/handle the same baltimore defense that shut down the phins.

so what is the difference – well QB for one, but is the pittsburgh QB that much better??? i my opinion yes, but it’s certainly possible that the gap is also Pitt’s WR’s are just much more of a threat and that opens up the baltimore defense…
i’m open to the arguement.

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 16, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The strong arm certainly helps.

You can’t lob a rainbow pass in the red zone and expect a touchdown.

by joel311 on Apr 17, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

My oh my you are a piece of biased work,

1- If these guys were “pretty dang good” it was because Pennington played to the best of their abilities. Davone Bess wouldnt have had half the year he had if it wasnt for Pennington.
For gods freaking sakes BRANDON LONDON SAID IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HE SAID IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

“CHAD PENNINGTON WAS OUR OFFENSE”

Not me, not nicky, not matty, not rz, NO, BRANDON LONDON, WR, MIAMI DOLPHINS.
Im not even going to continue. SLAP

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 17, 2009 2:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

speaking of bias

please tell – where in ANY of my posts on any of these threads did I say noodle boy isn’t accurate?

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 17, 2009 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

the recievers are pretty dang good. there were hardly any drops, let alone meaningful ones, last year. these guys made tough catches in tight spots, often on high floaters that got them rung up (and yes i do mean mssr martin who deserved a purple heart for the passes he caught from CP last year)…

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 17, 2009 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

where does that

say he’s inaccurate…. i think even john beck would agree CP’s deep passes float (or just ask Ed Reed)
that just means, he has a weak arm….

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 17, 2009 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

open your eyes

and watch a game – not from what happens but what is happening…. look at what the other teams defense is doing…

maybe you’ll learn something.

SLAP

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 17, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You are mistaken, nobody is saying that all the "how defenses react to cp10" thing is wrong.

I am not stupid, we all know that his arm strength has always been a huge disadvantage for him. My point is that you always find a way to give cp10 crap, and a lot of the times, you are just driven by a huge bias and your argument comes out as stupid.
In your first comment you stated that

“Im pretty torn and as i’ve frequently stated over the last 6 months… the recievers are pretty dang good. there were hardly any drops, let alone meaningful ones, last year.

and then you proceed to point out how Pennington is pretty much guilty for any weaknesses we find in our Wr corps.

these guys made tough catches in tight spots, often on high floaters that got them rung up
(and yes i do mean mssr martin who deserved a purple heart for the passes he caught
from CP last year)…
but the deep passes to ginn and YAC numbers were likely high because that is how defenses (well maybe not denver but then again they didnt play defense last year) lined up against miami
how much of that is the recievers or the fact that the red zone is one of those areas where a weak armed QB is exposed…

So basically what you are saying is that with a strong armed QB this WRs would be the shit, even comparable to the own Super Bowl champs. And that is just a boat load of crap. To say our receiver woes would be solved if only we had a strong armed Qb is bullshit. It is clear that we need a young QB that can make all the throws but it is even more clear that we need a true #1 WR.

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 17, 2009 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

first of all

can’t you live by what you write….

thats all im going to say

alas – why don’t you go back and maybe read my post instead of just taking your bias against me into every post….

but i will spell it out to you since you seem to have trouble with a 2 parter…. or a complex belief….

lets start at the top

i’m torn here
did you read that part??? certainly not….

now this post is about the receivers not the QB – so i kept it to that…. and what did i write….

as you snipped - Part 1 to paraphrase – the receivers are pretty dang good… they do their jobs well and make some tough catches…

part 2 – they have very few td catches… and really isn’t that how you evaluate receivers? so now is it a question that the receivers really arent very good in tight spaces because they aren’t big enough or quick enough and hence need to be upgrade (which is the question of this fanpost) or is it an issue that the weakness last years QB trumped the ability that the receivers showed between the 20’s …..

and it’s pretty clear by my next post that I just don’t know for sure….

so what is the difference – well QB for one, but is the pittsburgh QB that much better??? i my opinion yes, but it’s certainly possible that the gap is also Pitt’s WR’s are just much more of a threat and that opens up the baltimore defense…
i’m open to the arguement.

hence we go back to my opening statement “I’m torn”

so i’d rather you just read my posts and thank me for the job I do …..

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 18, 2009 2:01 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Look man, this is not a black and white discussion

its not about who said what or if you can back up your arguments with facts. Its about you bringing in Chad Pennington as the bad guy in every single post. Right now this post was about WRs. You not once mentioned Tedd Ginn’s development as a 3rd year player, you didnt mention Camarillo’s recovery or Bess’ potential. You couldnt analize if Tedd Ginn was a true #1 receiver or just a deep threat or if Wilford would be able to step in to the starting line up. You not once mentioned Brandon London, either his succesful development last year or the great chances he’s got to have a break out season. We are talking about WRs and yet you go on a soliloquy where you not once fail to mention Chad Pennington. Now, you argue that you mention Pennington because you relate these WRs capacities to Penningtons ability, or lack of. However, you not once mention Chad Henne and relate him to these guys to try and figure out if in the long run these guys could last or not. Because that was what we were trying to do, figure out if we “really need a wide receiver”, not if what separates us from Pittsburgh is a strong armed Qb. Now you see how you managed to turn a WR discussion into a QB discussion? specially a Pennington discussion?

Even in the live thread about the NFL releasing our schedule you managed to, with the first comment, make it about Pennington:

this is a terrible schedule….

unless they start Henne right at the start (week 4-6) it looks like we’ll be stuck with CP for the full 16

And to sum up everyones’ frustration:

really? now? Ugh…

The Phinsider: SBN’s Miami Dolphins blog

by Matty

by MauMontaV5 on Apr 18, 2009 3:16 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think both you (Mau) and WNY have valid points

But I think that when you evaluate a receiving corp, you have to discuss the QB. Would we fans be calling Larry Fitzgerald the best WR in the game if Matt Leinart was his QB? Was Andre Johnson one of the best in the game when David Carr was throwing to him? Randy Moss on the Raiders? Wes Welker on the Phins? You can make the same arguement for another 10 guys in the league.

Who is throwing the ball matters. And frankly, I can’t tell whether the phins WR corp is any good or not and a lot of that has to do with CP. He cannot make all the necessary throws, which then limits the routes the receivers run, which then limits my evaluation of them. I can’t tell you what the full picture is when I am only seeing 70%.

My gut tells me that the phins need another playmaker on the outside. I think Bess and Camarillo are good slot / possession / 3rd receivers and I think Ginn is a deep threat, but I don’t see a complement on the other side of the field. Maybe London is that guy, but I don’t know how anyone can say that when he has on 10 rec in a career.

by ct1361 on Apr 18, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

thanks for reading my post

I think you get it….. maybe you can write in simpler terms that mau might be able to understand.

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 19, 2009 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

For Mau:

When Chad Pennington throws a deep ball, it takes longer to reach its target. This extra hang time allows defensive backs to zero in on the point of reception well before the receiver actually grabs it. Chad P. may have the accuracy to get the ball to the receiver, but there is the increased chance that said receiver will take a heavy hit the moment he catches the ball. That lowers the YAC and YPC for our receivers. Our receiving corps if actually phenomenal.

by joel311 on Apr 19, 2009 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

TY

wow – I guess there are a few people around here who ‘get it’

From Merriam-Webster the meaning of gay
1 a: happily excited : merry b: keenly alive and exuberant : having or inducing high spirits

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 19, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

wow i just wish you would stick to your word
thats all im going to say

because once again, you either are NOT reading my posts or you really need to take a reading comprehension class… cause no where in this thread did i bash penne – other than to say he has a weak arm…

the recievers are pretty dang good. there were hardly any drops, let alone meaningful ones, last year. these guys made tough catches in tight spots, often on high floaters that got them rung up (and yes i do mean mssr martin who deserved a purple heart for the passes he caught from CP last year)…

unless of course you want to say martin getting carted off in on a stretcher (on almost every catch) is somehow a negative reflection on the receivers.

so go back and read my post and take your gay love for the noodle boy out of the equation… and you’ll understand that i think pretty highly of the recievers – except that we really wont know for sure about them until a strong armed QB takes over and opens up the field for them AND then we can find out if their weakness in the red zone is them or the QB.

by W NY Fins Fan on Apr 19, 2009 12:32 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Regardless of the way some on this site may feel

Our front office is evaluating 1st day WR’s and could very well select one.
So Parcells obviously feel it’s enough of a need to check out Nicks and Harvin personally. And if the BPA (for our system) at 25, 44 or 56 is a WR get on board baby!

25th LB – REY MAUALUGA USC = 44th CB ALPHONSO SMITH WAKE FOREST
56th OLB LAWRENCE SIDBURY/RICHMOND 87TH OG- HERMAN JOHNSON LSU
4th WR – JOHNNY KNOX ABILENE CHRISTIAN 5th QB – NATE DAVIS BALL ST
6TH OLB – JASON WILLIAMS WESTERN IL 7TH NT - VAUGHN MARTIN WESTERN ONTARIO == 7TH CB - DON CAREY NORFORK ST

by ATS16 on Apr 17, 2009 9:47 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Agreed that corner is more pressing....

but if we can get a proven WO I say lets do it. I’d take Braylon or Anquon. D is where our most pressing needs are though. Need a couple good DB’s and WE NEED TO PICK UP JT!!! along with drafting either Mattews or Mauluga

by dolphimite on Apr 17, 2009 10:20 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think its pretty much understood that we wont use a WR with pick 25

because CB is a bigger need, but this draft is deep at WR and I believe we will use at least our third rounder on one.

"How can I blame you
When it's me I can't forgive?"

-From the Unforgiven III off of Death Magnetic

by Patssuck456 on Apr 17, 2009 3:22 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

trade a qb from michigan & our #1 with st louis get a very good Q.B.

lots of ways to adress our fueture lets get the very best forget the jets we need an elite qb & all we have to do is structure a deal right now i realy like the top 4 qbs on the board but the top 2 are elite lets go get them with extra draft picks players whatever it takes

by wild zion beaver on Apr 19, 2009 12:52 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

So you're convinced that Stafford and/or Sanchez

is so much better than Henne that we should give up Henne AND our 25th overall pick?

Doesn’t make much sense from where I’m sitting, I’ll tell you that.

by Matty I on Apr 19, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

im convinced

if the best is there why gamble man, what was henne 2nd round 2nd pick he might of gone to third. u tell me this u think u know more then all these nfl gurus then why is there so much talk about qb flaco, its his arm-a lagit weppon please no more talk of a wide-out when the need is arm!!!!!!!!! every one of our recivers should have scored between 3-7 tds last year & u know that & a mater of fact this year year also.but with-out the year of experence between qb. & wr.your orphning our offence. just do our best to get the best arm out there. i was there aganst buffalo when what was it on first down cp threw a 35-40 yard bomb & he must of threw his arm a bit off couse i never saw a airel atack like that again.

by wild zion beaver on Apr 19, 2009 1:51 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think I know more than all these NFL gurus?

Really?

Or is your idea of drafting Stafford or Sanchez just completely ridiculous?

Oh – and have you seen Henne’s arm? His arm is every bit as strong as Stafford. And Sanchez has an average arm. Neither of them compare to Flacco’s.

But the bottom line here, like “fins72marino420” says below, is that this front office LOVES Henne. They think he’s the real deal. That’s all that matters.

Now I’m done with this because this is – by far – one of the most outrageous draft ideas I’ve heard in a long, long time.

by Matty I on Apr 19, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Our FO

Likes Henne alot and beleives he is our QB of the future and that’s goog enough for me

by fins72marino420 on Apr 19, 2009 1:51 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

well u most be owner why u think we (dolphins) got ridofa genius like david woodly

woodly (wantabe) why is it we dont see henne playing first team & dont tell me time marino started right in first year & never looked back.

by wild zion beaver on Apr 19, 2009 6:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

my op.is biased i want miami to win this year we have the knowlage

the next leavel is still real fresh & i’m sure coach can get that back from players. thats what playoffs do, train you for next level-no u cant teach arm strength. hey

by wild zion beaver on Apr 19, 2009 7:04 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

quit while youre ahead, man

El Peezy... "the Calvin Johnson of rookies.. instant impact" -Prime Time
"el peezy strikes fear in opponent bloggers hearts" -finsx

by el presidente 00 on Apr 19, 2009 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

kneejerk reaction!

(hay matty l) just to let u no,not trying to make any waves-but if i can this typ of a reaction out of you. we only know what someone might suspect of what we are capeable!!!!!!!! miami dolphins as a team (draft wize)

by wild zion beaver on Apr 19, 2009 11:40 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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